HOUSE COMMITTEE ON

ENVIRONMENT AND LAND USE

 

 

January 21, 2003†† Hearing Room E

8:30 AM†††† Tapes4 - 5

 

MEMBERS PRESENT:††††††††††† Rep. Bill Garrard, Chair

Rep. Dennis Richardson, Vice-Chair

Rep. Cliff Zauner, Vice Chair

Rep. Robert Ackerman

Rep. Mitch Greenlick

Rep. Diane Rosenbaum

 

MEMBER EXCUSED:††††††††††† Rep. Dan Doyle

 

STAFF PRESENT:††††† ††††††††††† Ray Kelly, Committee Administrator

David Peffley, Committee Assistant

 

MEASURE/ISSUES HEARD:††††††††††† Informational meeting††††††††††

††††††††††††††††††††††† ††††††††††††††††††††††† †††††††† Invited testimony

††††††††††††††††††††††† ††††††††††††††††††††††† ††††††††††† Dr. John Beaulieu, Oregon Department of Geology and

††††††††††††††††††††††† ††††††††††††††††††††††† ††††††††††† ††††† Mining Industries (DOGAMI)

††††††††††††††††††††††† ††††††††††††††††††††††† ††††††††††† Don Schellenberg, Oregon Farm Bureau (OFB)

††††††††††††††††††††††† ††††††††††††††††††††††† ††††††††††† Bob Rendy, Department of Land Conservation and

††††††††††††††††††††††† ††††††††††††††††††††††† ††††††††††† ††††† Development (LCDC)

††††††††††††††††††††††† ††††††††††† ††††††††††† HB 2137 - Public Hearing

††††††††††††††††††††††† †††††††††††††††††††††††

 

These minutes are in compliance with Senate and House Rules.Only text enclosed in quotation marks reports a speakerís exact words.For complete contents, please refer to the tapes.

 

TAPE/#

Speaker

Comments

TAPE 4, A

005

Chair Garrard

Chair calls meeting to order at 8:40 AM.Announces his intent to begin the hearing on HB 2137 at 9:15. Opens the informational meeting.

INFORMATIONAL MEETING

008

Dr. John Beaulieu

Oregon Department of Geology and Mineral Industries (DOGAMI). Gives brief introduction to DOGAMI, and their strategic plan through

  • (EXHIBIT A) Mission Statement
  • (EXHIBIT B) Water and Geology informational piece
  • (EXHIBIT C) Benefits explanation.
  • (EXHIBIT D) Legislative interests for the 72nd legislative session.

111

Rep. Greenlick

Asks witness to explain how maps stop development.

113

Dr. Beaulieu

Responds that a provision in SB 12 provides a 10-month moratorium on development.

133

Rep. Greenlick

Asks for copies of these maps.

136

Dr. Beaulieu

Explains that itís not financially prudent due to exorbitant mapping costs.

161

Don Schellenberg

Oregon Farm Bureau.Introduces testimony (EXHIBIT E)States concern with land use planningís effect on farming.Also states concerns with the 20-year buildable supply requirement.

264

Rep. Ackerman

Asks whether the urban growth boundary is a ďno growth boundary.Ē

266

Schellenberg

Responds that it could be in certain instances, although itís not necessarily so.

294

Bob Rindy

Legislative Coordinator for Department of Land Conservation and Development (LCDC).Presents departmental overview and LCDCís dedication to Oregonís 19 Statewide Planning Goals and Guidelines.Describes the process of appeals and review.

346

Rindy

Continues with key provision introduction: urban growth boundaries

400

Rep. Richardson

Comments that in his district, land has been maintained and protected, but that there is a significant loss in actual farm land.Asks whether that is generally the case and what can be done.

408

Rindy

Responds that LCDC can not enforce how the land is actually used.

TAPE5, A

002

Rindy

Continues with the difficulties in enforcing land use.

030

Rep. Greenlick

States that he would like to also hear at a later time the process by which decisions are made on METRO plans.

034

Chair Garrard

Closes informational part of meeting and opens a public hearing on††††† HB 2137.

The following testimony was submitted for the record without public testimony.

 

Jason Heuser

Submits (EXHIBIT F).

HB 2137 Ė PUBLIC HEARING

040

Rep. Close

Interim co-chair of Joint Natural Resources Committee, which produced HB 2137.Introduces (EXHIBIT G) as her testimony

103

Rep. Ackerman

Asks whether joint committee has identified a fiscal impact.

109

Rep. Close

Remarks that she has not gone to legislative fiscal.

113

Rep. Ackerman

Asks whether the Joint Natural Resources Committee consulted with county or city officials regarding fiscal impact.

115

Rep. Close

Responds that their joint committee did solicit such testimony.

122

Rep. Ackerman

Asks whether there are municipalities which support the bill in its present form.

124

Rep. Close

Responds that Linn County commissioners support the bill.

126

Rep. Ackerman

Asks whether the support is formal.

128

Rep. Close

Responds that they have only discussed it casually and that thereís no resolution at this point.

131

Rep. Ackerman

Asks what would be the extent of the awards fiscally.

133

Rep. Close

Responds that it can not be determined until it goes through Legislative Fiscal.

136

Rep. Ackerman

Asks if she might support an amendment which would eliminate cash awards.

138

Rep. Close

Responds that such an amendment would be up to the committee, but that we need the cash alternative

141

Rep. Ackerman

Asks what the fiscal impacts of Measure 7 would have been

149

Rep. Close

Replies that youíd need to speak with the drafters of the measure.She personally doesnít remember.

153

Rep. Ackerman

Asks ifseven billion dollars is an accurate number.

155

Rep. Close

Responds that she doesnít believe that figure to be accurate.

159

Rep. Ackerman

Asks if she could conceive of land use regulations which could lead to the appreciation of property.

161

Rep. Close

Believes that it is conceivable, but that sheís more comfortable leaving a judge to answer such questions.

164

Rep. Ackerman

Asks if it would be reasonable to support an amendment regarding appreciated value.

168

Rep. Close

Believes itís an interesting idea and that Rep Ackerman should propose such an amendment.

172

Chair Garrard

Thanks witness.Informs that this committee will be deliberate with this very important issue.

174

Clif Kenagy

Introduces testimony (EXHIBIT H) in opposition to HB 2137.Mr. Kenagy states that he could potentially support it with provisions for appropriate and adequate funding.

233

Liz Frankel

League of Women Voters. Introduces testimony (EXHIBIT I) stating that the LWV believes the bill to be in opposition to the Oregon Statewide Land User Planning program.

278

Rep. Rosenbaum

Questions the appropriate use of the legislature in this matter.

289

Frankel

Responds that she thinks that the legislature is an appropriate forum, although that may not necessarily be the LWVís position.Disagrees with Rep. Closeís testimony.

322

Rep. Greenlick

Follows up on Rep Ackermanís concern.Asks whether the LWV believes that the government should compensate for its takings.Asks whether the property owners should share the value of a property increase.

345

Frankel

Responds that they may, but adds that itís difficult to quantify.

350

Rep. Greenlick

Agrees and believes that fairness should go in both directions.

354

Frankel

Restates that fairness is in the eye of the beholder.

376

Rep. Williams

Gives experience from his work on this issue during the last session.States complicity of this issue.Denotes issues to consider and that it will be a difficult task to strike a fair balance.

TAPE 4, B

001

Rep. Williams

Continues testimony on the complexities of figuring property values and compensation in isolated cases.

088

Rep. Ackerman

Asks Rep Williams for the financial impact of the measure.

096

Rep. Williams

Responds that he doesnít know the exact figures.Continues that issues such as subdivisions complicate the issue.Doesnít think that anyone really knows the answer.

150

Rep. Ackerman

Asks if it would be prudent to pass this bill without available funds or without realizing the full financial impact.

161

Rep. Williams

Responds that if we deal with financial issues first, the bill wouldnít get out the door.Believes that we should solve the issue first, then worry about the financial impact.

203

Rep. Ackerman

Asks if Rep Williams would support an offset based on what the appreciated value would be.

218

Rep. Williams

Responds that he would.

221

Chair Garrard

Asks if land takings are more an issue for the federal or local government.

235

Rep. Williams

Responds that this issue too is very vague.Itís difficult to know whether an agency is following a federal or state statute.

262

Rep.Zauner

Asks whether Rep Williams ever came up with any idea as to how many parcels were effected.

254

Rep. Williams

Believes that parcels are limited at 10, but isnít appraised of all the amendments, so that number may be outdated.

280

Rep. Rosenbaum

Believes that the sense of urgency has waned and that there could be another way of approaching this issue.

296

Rep. Williams

Responds that this is a real issue and believes that an initiative isnít the best way to go about.Adds that if we donít act, there will be an initiative which may not be as good as what the legislature can do.

342

Rep. Greenlick

Sees that the bill contains two main elements. Asks if itís appropriate to address both by this bill.

353

Rep. Williams

Affirms that they are both vital issues that need to be addressed.Also adds that there was even disagreement within the committee.

389

Rep. Greenlick

Asks whether Rep Williams would support breaking this into 2 separate bills.

395

Rep. Williams

Believes that this is an issue which will need to be addressed by the committee.

TAPE 5, B

011

Charlotte Lehan

Mayor of Wilsonville.Submits (EXHIBIT J) in opposition to HB 2137Asserts that the bill is flawed and ill-advised at a time when funding is at a nadir.

081

Chair Kropf

Introduces Harlan Levy.

084

Harlan Levy

Staff attorney for the Oregon Association of Realtors.Affirms support for HB 2137.States that the iniquities alluded to by Rep. Williams.andneed to be addressed by legislature.

125

Rep. Richardson

Asks if the issue that private lands should not be taken without just compensation is what is at the heart of this bill.

131

Levy

Responds affirmatively.

134

Rep. Richardson

Follows by asking that if it is his position that if they donít deal with the underlying problem then weíll have to deal with the wrath of the people.

138

Levy

Concurs that Rep Richardsonís concern is their position.

140

Rep. Greenlick

Asks whether the degree of provision is whatís at issue here.

143

Levy

Reasserts that they donít want to address compensation.Compensation should be a last resort.

148

Rep. Greenlick

Asks if the constitutional requirement is covered, but just triggered at the wrong level.

153

Levy

Concurs with Rep Greenlick.States need to reduce bureaucratic red tape in the court system.

163

Art Schlack

Policy Manager, Association of Oregon Counties. Introduces testimony (EXHIBIT K) -six principles guiding their position on HB 2137.

247

Chair Garrard

Adjourns meeting.

 

 

EXHIBIT SUMMARY

 

A Ė Informational materials, Dr. John Beaulieu, 12 pp.

B Ė Informational materials, Dr. JohnBeaulieu, 6 pp.

C Ė Informational materials, Dr. John Beaulieu, 1 p.

D Ė Informational materials, Dr. John Beaulieu, 1 p.

E Ė Informational materials, Don Schellenberg, 2 pp.

F Ė HB 2137, City of Eugene written testimony, Jason Heuser, 1 p.

G - HB 2137, written testimony, Representative Betsy Close, 1 p.

H - HB 2137, written testimony, Clif Kenagy, 1 p.

I -- HB 2137, written testimony, Liz Frankel, 1 p.

J Ė HB 2137, written testimony, Charlotte Lehan, 2 pp.

K - HB 2137, written testimony, Art Schlack, 2 pp.