HOUSE COMMITTEE ON

AGRICULTURE AND NATURAL RESOURCES

 

May 25, 2005 Hearing Room C

8:30 A.M. Tapes  69 - 70

 

MEMBERS PRESENT:            Rep. Patti Smith, Chair

Rep. Brian Boquist, Vice-Chair

Rep. Arnie Roblan, Vice-Chair

Rep. Terry Beyer

Rep. Chuck Burley

Rep. Mark Hass

Rep. Mac Sumner

 

STAFF PRESENT:                  Patrick Brennan, Committee Administrator

Jania Zeeb, Committee Assistant

 

MEASURES/ISSUES HEARD:        

SJM 4 – Public Hearing and Work Session

SB 184 – Public Hearing

SB 191 – Public Hearing

SB 389A – Public Hearing and Work Session

 

These minutes are in compliance with Senate and House Rules.  Only text enclosed in quotation marks reports a speaker’s exact words.  For complete contents, please refer to the tapes.

 

TAPE/#

Speaker

Comments

TAPE 69, A

004

Chair P. Smith

Calls the meeting to order at 8:43 a.m. and opens a public hearing on SJM 4

SJM 4 – PUBLIC HEARING

010

Sen. Charlie Ringo

Senate District 17.  Testifies in support of SJM 4.  Discusses the importance of citizen access to public lands.

031

Dave Kelsey

Testifies in support of SJM 4.

045

Chair Smith

Closes the public hearing and opens a work session on SJM 4.

SJM 4 – WORK SESSION

048

Rep. Boquist

MOTION:  Moves SJM 4 be sent to the floor with a BE ADOPTED recommendation.

 

 

VOTE:  7-0-0

AYE:            In a roll call vote, all members present vote Aye.

 

Chair P. Smith

The motion CARRIES.

REP. ROBLAN will lead discussion on the floor.

061

Chair P. Smith

Closes the work session on SJM 4 and opens a public hearing on       SB 184.

SB 184 – PUBLIC HEARING

067

Patrick Brennan

Committee Administrator.  Summarizes SB 184.

077

Chuck Craig

Oregon Department of Agriculture (ODA).  Submits prepared testimony in support of SB 184 (EXHIBIT A), and informational material on the changes to SB 184 (EXHIBIT B).  Discusses what the bill would do. 

111

Rep. Boquist

Asks if the department consulted with the stakeholders on this issue.

113

Craig

Answers that the industry testified in favor of SB 184 in the Senate Environment and Land Use Committee.

114

Chair P. Smith

Asks Mr. Craig if he is aware of an amendment being drafted for       SB 184. 

116

Craig

Responds that he is not aware of any amendments.

117

Rep. Sumner

Asks if the measure would impair the ability of private property owners or amateur gardeners from purchasing fertilizers ans soil amendments.

120

Craig

Responds that it does not, adding that it also allows the private landowner to find out what is in the product.

128

Rep. Boquist

Asks if the bill would result in manufactures no longer shipping certain products to Oregon.

133

Matt Haines

ODA.  Responds that such a situation has happened only in relation to one product and explains the situation.

144

Chair P. Smith

Closes the public hearing on SB 184 and opens a public hearing on    SB 191.

SB 191 – PUBLIC HEARING

150

Patrick Brennan

Committee Administrator.  Summarizes SB 191.  Discusses the revised fiscal impact statement.

180

Dave Vant’hof

Governor’s Natural Resources Office.  Explains the changes that have been made to SB 191. 

196

Bob Repine

Director, Oregon Housing Community Services Department (OHCSD).  Submits prepared testimony regarding SB 191 and a report on the sustainability board (EXHIBIT C).  Discusses the benefits of the Sustainability Board and the importance of maintaining the discussion on sustainability.

247

Bill Blosser

Member, Sustainability Board.  Discusses what the sustainability board views its efforts as doing (EXHBIT C, Page 2).  Talks about the key areas the board is focused on in order to bring value to the people of Oregon

294

Rep. Hass

Inquires whether a fiscal impact statement is needed.

300

Blosser

Responds that the board has no state funding, and is currently utilizing volunteers to function. 

315

Chair P. Smith

States that the committee has received a revised fiscal impact statement (EXHIBIT J) for SB 191.

328

Lynn Lundquist

Oregon Business Association (OBA).  Testifies in support of SB 191.  Discusses the benefits of the Sustainability Board from the perspective of OBA.  Comments that OBA believes that there is a competitive advantage to sustaining quality of life through environmentally sound business practices.

399

John Ledger

Associated Oregon Industries (AOI).  Discusses the history behind the original legislation that established the board.  Comments on the importance of formally bringing the agricultural community into the process

TAPE 70, A

027

Chair P. Smith

Closes the public hearing on SB 191 and opens a public hearing on   SB 389-A.

SB 389A – PUBLIC HEARING

036

Patrick Brennan

Committee Administrator.  Summarizes SB 389-A.  Discusses the –A4 amendments (EXHIBIT D), and –A5 amendments (EXHIIBT E).

061

Chair P. Smith

Remarks that she is one of the sponsors of SB 389-A and she is in full support of the bill and amendments.

066

Jerod Broadfoot

Safari Club International (SCI) “First for Hunters”.  Testifies in support of SB 389A and the –A5 amendments.  Talks about what SB 389-A does and states that hunting on the internet is not ethical and not a fair chase of animals.  Remarks that SCI wants internet hunting banned. 

097

Broadfoot

Discusses the –A5 amendments and what they would do.  Comments on the problems that the ban on the use of dogs in the hunting of cougars has caused. 

151

Broadfoot

Remarks that the –A5 amendments do not amend ORS 694, rather if an individual petitions their county, then the question can be brought before the voters of the county. 

181

Broadfood

Discusses the fact that the Oregon Department of Fish and Wildlife (ODFW) still has control over how many tags are released. 

203

Rep. Hass

Asks which is more important to Mr. Broadfoot, the original bill or the –A5 amendments

206

Broadfoot

Responds that both are equally important.

211

Rep. Hass

Comments that adopting the amendments put the whole bill in jeopardy. 

222

Broadfoot

Disagrees that the amendments jeopardize the legislation, and asserts that the amendment is not controversial. 

233

Chair P. Smith

Adds that there were fifty co-sponsors to HB 2759, another bill dealing with hunting cougars with hounds.

235

Rep. Hass

States that it is a big enough issue that should be considered on its own merits separately from SB 389-A.

242

Rep. Burley

Asks how SB 389-A, without the –A5 amendments, would apply to Oregonians.  Inquires if it would prohibit people from establishing businesses like the one in Texas in Oregon, or if it would prohibit Oregonians from accessing the site in Texas.

251

Broadfoot

Answers that there is no way to regulate what happens in Texas, so the measure seeks to ban the establishment of similar facilities in Oregon.

265

Rep. Burley

Asks if a person would be in violation of this law if  they were to access the site in Texas and shoot a weapon.

276

Broadfoot

Responds that the person would not be in violationbecause the firearm is in the state of Texas.

290

Rep. Burley

Refers to page 3 paragraph 19 of SB 389-A and asks why ODFW is exempted from the prohibition.

315

Broadfoot

Gives an example of ODFW management and emphasizes the need to make sure ODFW has the flexibility to deal with the issue for management purposes.

360

Ron Anglin

Wildlife Division Administrator, ODFW.  Submits prepared testimony in support of SB 389-A (EXHIBIT F).  Discusses why there is an exemption for ODFW in the bill. 

414

Anglin

States that the Department has not taken a position on the -A5 amendments.

421

Rep. Roblan

Asks if the -5 amendments put any conditions on ODFW’s management of the populations of these animals.

TAPE 69, B

011

Anglin

Responds that the commission still has full authority to set seasons and the manner of take.   

016

Rep. Sumner

Requests confirmation that the department is not taking a position on the -A5 amendments.

018

Anglin

Concurs.

020

Rep. Burley

Inquires how much of ODFW’s budget if funded by hunting license fees.

023

Anglin

Responds by breaking down the Wildlife Division budget.

028

Rep. Burley

Asks about the general trend with the populations of mule deer and elk in eastern Oregon.

030

Anglin

Answers that both species have been declining for a variety of reasons. 

040

Rep. Burley

Inquires if ODFW has reduced the number of tags available.

041

Anglin

Answers affirmatively.

045

Sally Mackler

Sierra Club.  Submits packet of informational material regarding hunting cougars with hounds (EXHIBIT G).

123

Mackler

Discusses the possibility of fiscal impact for the state if the –A5 amendments are adopted.

140

Mackler

Expresses concerns with the language in SB 389-A to solve the problem.

155

Mackler

Testifies in opposition to the -A5 amendments and states that the cost- benefit ratio is sufficient to cause Sierra Club to oppose the bill as amended with the –A5 amendments.

169

Rep. Burley

Asks why ORS 498.012 is highlighted in Ms. Mackler’s testimony (EXHIBIT G, Page 3).

172

Mackler

Discusses why the information was included.

205

Rep. Burley

Asks if Ms. Mackler is saying that under ORS 498.012 a landowner or producer can use hounds to hunt cougars on their own property to control damage.

215

Mackler

Concurs.

218

Rep. Burley

Questions whether that is explicitly stated in ORS 498.012.

230

Kelly Peterson

Humane Society of the United States (HSUS).  Submits prepares testimony regarding SB 389 (EXHIBIT H)  and informational material regarding hunting cougars with dogs (EXHIBIT I).  States that a bill such as this should stand alone and the public should have the opportunity to testify on the issue. 

266

Rep. Boquist

Asks what is being done by HSUS in regard to internet hunting.

269

Peterson

Answers that she does not know.

280

Rep. Burley

Comments that the numbers of cougars harvested has increased.  Expresses concerns that as a result of predators, there have been significant declines in the populations of game animals in certain areas of the state.  Refers to a report on the number of deer and elk in Yellowstone National Park.  Asks how the state should handle the problem to prevent the decimation of game herds. 

313

Mackler

Responds that it is unfortunate that the populations are experiencing decline, but there is no scientific research to support that predators are primarily responsible for the decline.

389

Rep. Burley

Comments that when Mr. Anglin discussed calf survival, he was not explicit on whether it was a birth issue or a survival problem, and many of them are preyed upon until they are up to two weeks old.  Asks if the Sierra Club would support more active management to create better habitat and forage. 

404

Mackler

Replies affirmatively.

420

Rep. Roblan

Expresses his concern with safety for those who are using the land for recreation.  Asks for ideas in how to handle safety.

TAPE 70, B

024

Mackler

Responds that with rural areas will always have predators and there will always be conflicts.  Remarks that there is no way to ensure there will not be conflicts.

051

Rep. Roblan

Recognizes that take has increase but has not increased with the growth of population.  Asks how to maintain the ideal number of cougars as identified by ODFW.

062

Mackler

Responds that no one knows how many cougars are in Oregon.  Remarks on media attention on the issue.  Refers to the model ODFW uses to determine how many cougars are in the state.

080

Rep. Roblan

Agrees that using a model is a hard way to keep track of the number of cougars.  States that the model could err both on the side of being too conservative and on the side of being to generous. 

086

Mackler

States that as a rule large predators are self limiting and do not overrun the land like deer or elk.

090

Chair P. Smith

Inquires what the Sierra Club is doing to educate people about the cougar population.

094

Mackler

Responds that Sierra Club efforts do not receive much media attention, but that the organization tries to inform people through its own networks.

 

103

Rep. Burley

Refers to the cougar that is establishing its area in Bend.  Comments that using dogs is a much more effective way of harvesting cougars, and it is important to get the population under control before a human is attacked and killed.

123

Mackler

Remarks that the management objective has been set and the kill quotas have been set and that both can be increased if need be.  States that the law allows the use of dogs to handle a problem animal. 

150

Al Elkins

Oregon Hunters Association.  Testifies in support of SB 389-A.  Discusses the history behind SB 389-A. 

192

Elkins

Testifies in support of the –A5 amendments.  States that the amendments allow people to exercise local control. 

213

Ron Harder

National Rifle Association.  Testifies in support of SB 389-A and discusses the benefits of the bill.  States that something must be done with regard to the cougars and testifies in support of the –A5 amendments

244

Chair P. Smith

Closes the public hearing on SB 389A and opens a work session.

SB 389A – WORK SESSION

248

Rep. Boquist

MOTION:  Moves to ADOPT SB 389 -A5 amendments dated 5/25/05.

251

Rep. Hass

Comments on the need to be practical and discusses the possibilities of what will happen if the bill is not amended or if it is amended.  Expresses the fear that SB 389-A will be voted down as a result of the amendments, and asserts that to be practical is to understand that the amendments put the bill in jeopardy.  Comments on the possibility of introducing the –A5 amendments as a separate bill to live or die on it’s own merits. 

278

Chair P. Smith

Expresses a concern with the cougar population management in this state and the difficulty of addressing those issues.

284

Rep. Boquist

Responds that he does not disagree with Rep. Hass regarding practicality, but practically speaking this is the only way to get a dialogue with the other parties that are involved.

295

Rep. Beyer

Expresses agreement with Rep. Hass because these are two separate issues that should stand alone.  Discusses her discomfort dealing with bears.  Comments on her concern with losing the original bill.

318

Rep. Sumner

States that he agrees with Rep. Hass in that it makes passage of the bill more problematic, but that does not excuse them from doing the right thing.  Comments on the importance of controlling cougars as soon as possible.

325

 

VOTE:  6-1-0

AYE:              6 - Beyer, Boquist, Burley, Roblan, Sumner, Smith P.

NAY:              1 - Hass

 

Chair P. Smith

The motion CARRIES.

 

335

Rep. Rep Boquist

MOTION:  Moves SB 389-A to the floor with a DO PASS AS AMENDED recommendation.

 

 

VOTE:  6-1-0

AYE:              6 - Beyer, Boquist, Burley, Roblan, Sumner, Smith P.

NAY:              1 - Hass

 

Chair P. Smith

The motion CARRIES.

REP. BOQUIST will lead discussion on the floor.

377

Chair P. Smith

Closes the work session on SB 389-A and adjourns the meeting at 10:30 a.m.

 

EXHIBIT SUMMARY

 

  1. A.     SB 184, prepared testimony, Chuck Craig, 1 p
  2. B.     SB 184, prepared testimony, Chuck Craig, 2 pp
  3. C.     SB 191, informational material, Bob Repine, 16 pp
  4. D.    SB 389-A, -A4 amendments, staff, 1 p
  5. E.     SB 389-A, -A5 amendments, staff, 1 p
  6. F.      SB 389-A, prepared testimony, Roy Elicker, 1 p
  7. G.    SB 389-A, informational material, Sally Mackler, 7 pp
  8. H.    SB 389-A, prepared testimony, Kelly Peterson, 1 p
  9. I.       SB 389-A, informational material, Kelly Peterson, 5 pp
  10. J.      SB 191, fiscal impact statement, staff, 2 pp